Temporarily took yesterday’s light-hearted post down. Sorry. I’ll put an updated version up (including all the new photos that everyone has been inundating me with!) soon. Essentially before it goes up, to place it into context, I need to finish my analysis on what the response I’ve received says about Australian society and culture, the Australian media, and also politics in the web 2.0 age – but as a social experiment this really has worked beyond my wildest dreams!
Plus, I need to work out what to do with the issue of comment moderation, and a few other minor things (like doing a male equivalent – Simon in his SES uniform has already secured himself top billing!)
We apologise for any inconvenience caused & all other similar cliches.
In the meantime, I’m interested in people’s thoughts on what I should do about comment moderation.
Update: I really can’t be bothered commenting on the sillyness of some in the Australian Media at this stage. But, for the benefit of the mentally-challenged, allow me to clarify: I have nothing to do with the Lib Students or YL’s anymore. This isn’t any sort of recruitment drive. This was a joke between friends. A joke. Humour is a concept the Australian political scene is tragically devoid of, so if you’re unaware of the concept, you can look it up on Wikipedia here. So stop being so uptight, or thinking that I’m pimping off girls in some nefarious plan.
The Musings of a Burkean Libertarian 
May 20, 2009 at 8:41 pm
I shudder to think who’s going to make the male version, Tim. Oh dear!
May 20, 2009 at 8:52 pm
You really shouldn’t have caved in. There’s no need to put anything into context. Some people will find it offensive and get uppity about it no matter what you say. Interestingly, these same people will often turn around and complain about political correctness in other areas. Aren’t they versatile?
This radical turn around almost suggests that you think the do-gooders have a point. They don’t. Put it back up.
Comment moderation probably isn’t something you need to worry about unless you plan to be linked to by several major blogs and media outlets on a regular basis.
May 20, 2009 at 9:00 pm
In my view Tim, you should always retain control of your blog and that includes comment moderation. It is however up to you how much “free speech” you will allow. You should not allow your constructive blog to be a place to broadcast hate etc. Stupidity and ignorance however should be displayed for all to see so do not edit those posts out of your blog.
As well as analysing “Australian society and culture, the Australian media, and also politics in the web 2.0 age” why don’t you also analyse what you want to achieve as a commentator on the subjects you cover. Do we have enough tabloid rubbish already? Think about where you position yourself. What will we discover is inside the mind of Tim?
May 20, 2009 at 9:06 pm
Under Australian Law though, it is my understanding that if defamatory remarks are made in the comments section of a blog, I can be held legally liable for them. Personally, I think this is, well, insane, but I do believe it is the law as it currently stands. And furthermore, I don’t actually have to be in Australia to be found guilty of it. Which is obviously slightly problematic!
May 20, 2009 at 9:28 pm
I think you should obviously do the libertarian thing and censor all comments at all times and ban people from contributing and have a speech code. I’m sure all the freedom loving twits orbiting the “mind of Tim” will agree. Have fun chappies!
May 20, 2009 at 10:11 pm
You can right anything as long as you dont use the words “deficit” or “billion”.
May 20, 2009 at 10:13 pm
Yes I mean “right”!
May 20, 2009 at 10:51 pm
While you cannot be seen to be a publisher of defamatory material, if you knowingly permit someone to post information which is in fact defamatory and you are able to prevent publication, you can be held liable. If this situation arose, your only defence could be innocent dissemination, which is hard to prove in any event.
You’re also right about jurisdiction. With internet content, like with other torts, it’s where a person downloads material from that the damage to reputation occurs and ergo, is the place where defamation is committed.
May 20, 2009 at 11:00 pm
oh and what should you do about comment moderation? well cause aus is communist (see above) -you should make the website settings so that comments are not posted until you approve them as moderator.
May 21, 2009 at 12:27 am
#
Well done on ensuring, Tim, that you can now never be taken as a serious possability for *any* public Liberal position in the future.
I for one, congratulate you on the immense bravery it must have taken in placing this on the internet (which as we know will now be here for ever in some form) to haunt you in all your future public endeavours… it *is* a bold move.
I know you *think* its witty – but 15 years from now – if you happen to be up for preselection – this will be waiting for you with open arms. how will you defend it then – or do you think you wont need to?
And social experiment my arse – thats what people who have just been exposed as horribly out of touch tout as their reasoning – who are you – Captain Mainwaring?.
May 21, 2009 at 12:40 am
The ABC and even more communist Pru Goward’s stupid attack on Tim for having a bit of fun – he could just as easily made the pics a selection of Tory blokes – is pathetic, miserable and loathsome.
The nanny state is alive and well.
Keep having fun with the site Tim and having the courage of your convictions. If the mindlessly politically correct Thought Police of the ABC and their comrade Pru Goward had their way, we’d be a world without fun and frivolity.
Strange isn’t it that the kids in the Libs are mature enough in their own skins to have a laugh but a bunch of prudish ageing Baby Boomers can’t handle what was clearly intended to be jovial and good-natured.
May 21, 2009 at 12:43 am
“bit of fun”
“nanny state”
“though police”
“mindlessly politically correct”
BINGO!
I’m assuming this is parody?
if you can’t see why this is a serious matter, and why id does not reflet well on you or your beliefs… then you really DO have some problems ahead.
May 21, 2009 at 12:47 am
Oh I wish I could go back and edit my mistakes – just as I bet Tim wishes he could too!
Others backing Tim as somehow “fighting the power” – pick your battles – is this the one you want stand your ground on?
May 21, 2009 at 12:55 am
For those of you suffering withdrawal symptoms from not being able to access the original site, which is now passworded, you can enjoy it all here: Google Cache.
Here is some news commentary on the subject: Young Liberal’s racy recruitment bid ‘disappointing’ ABC News Online and Young Liberals ‘hot babes’ blog draws criticism from Pru Goward LiveNews.com.au.
Unfortunately for those with a soft spot (or should that be hard spot) for the Federal Opposition Leader’s media advisor, no, Liz Davies’ photos are not among those salvaged by LiveNews.com.au or Google Cache… we will all just have to learn to live with the loss…
May 21, 2009 at 12:56 am
Did you really think that you could post that without getting this type of reaction? Or was it just a….wait for it…..Chaser style prank?
May 21, 2009 at 1:02 am
There was some nice looking girls there. Do you think any of them will mature and vote Labor?
May 21, 2009 at 1:14 am
Could this total non-event have been blown any more out of proportion? So Tim, a young lib, puts up a couple of pics of fully clothed (bikinis accepted) young women, of legal age, on his personal blog and the ABC picks it up like Malcolm Turnbull has just been caught with his pants around his ankles in a room full of hookers. Anyone recall where our current PM was caught in NY a couple of years back?
And ‘mature’ and vote labor? Because communist ideals are such a mature idea – certainly not harboured by young impressionable youth AT ALL…
May 21, 2009 at 1:21 am
“personal blog and the ABC picks it up”… but its okay when Andrew bolt picks it up?
The problem here is with the *understanding* that it shows. The lack of *forsight* it shows. The poor *timing* it shows…
He might have posted it with harmless intention – but for some people that just makes it *worse* as he doesn’t get why its not appropriate. Nor apparently do some others.
No understanding of how this post will be sen. No ability to forsee what might arise out of it. No ability to see now was not the time for such a post… and if theres an argument that its a personal post… crickey guys… this is politics – use your head – its going to get out there!
What it also shows is that any chance of a public career Tim might have have had with an Australian political party is already ended.
Vale Tim – we hardly knew ye…
May 21, 2009 at 1:23 am
Hey David,
I think you’ll find that some of those girls don’t vote Liberal. Catriona Rafael admitted to me once that she doesn’t vote for the Coalition at all (I bet she’s just dying to find out who I am!).
That was the point I was making in my initial post and follow up on the original site which is now accessible via the Google Cache: there is nothing conservative about this “social experiment” (to borrow from Tim).
May 21, 2009 at 1:25 am
Communists—Australian Labor in the same sentence? Off the planet– not, Out of Proportion. Also look at Kate Ellis, Tanya Plibersek, they matured and voted Labor. Better looking and 10 years older, than Tim’s collective. Ayn Rand was a genius? Not really. A pissed off Ruski who lost the family pharmacy. November ’07, a great month.
May 21, 2009 at 1:33 am
Hey Greg,
I have been advocating modesty and restraint all along, dimwit. That was the point of my argument: the hedonistic permissive culture of many of the girls featured here illustrates their lack of respect for themselves and that this can hardly be a “conservative” indicator of anything. If they want to be treated like ladies, here’s a tip, they can start acting like ladies; if they want something altogether different, they shouldn’t complain if they are treated like pieces of meat by the men in their lives. Neanderthals are like moths to a flame to this kind of sluttery. Like I said before, actions have consequences – grow some personal responsibility. Their behaviour and many of their apologists are inimical to conservatism by any moral criterion.
May 21, 2009 at 1:55 am
Henry,
Well hey now, I don’t usually rise to the bait, but this needs addressing.
“I think you’ll find that some of those girls don’t vote Liberal. Catriona Rafael admitted to me once that she doesn’t vote for the Coalition at all (I bet she’s just dying to find out who I am!).”
I have voted twice in my life, at the recent Federal and State elections (and will vote for a third time on Saturday in my local council election). Both times I have voted for the Coalition, not that it’s any of your business.
Feel free to spread lies about yourself, whomever you are, but spreading lies about other people is quite another thing (and I do have a very good idea who you are, as betrayed by your prejudices. Whoops!).
May 21, 2009 at 1:55 am
Suuuuure Catriona, sure you voted Coalition. We believe you, really we do!
PS: you have absolutely no idea and no clue.
May 21, 2009 at 1:59 am
Lmao, you seem to be suffering from a failure of logic.
May 21, 2009 at 2:02 am
Do I indeed. You seem to be suffering from a failure of something altogether far more profound my dear.
May 21, 2009 at 2:09 am
Oh, I’m sensing some deep-seated resentment here! Englighten us, wouldn’t you, ever so kindly?
May 21, 2009 at 2:14 am
Dont fall for her tricks Henry!
She’s trying to dilute the wonder of Tim’s f**kup by derailing the thread!
Looks like its on CNNPolitics now.
May 21, 2009 at 2:21 am
It has to be noted that each individual photo shown in the “offending” blog post consented to their image being used. I think some people have really shown how wowserish they can really be.
May 21, 2009 at 2:22 am
I prefer to keep Catriona in the dark. More fun for me that way. Don’t worry, we’re bound to bump into each other again in your little meetings out and about. The moral of the story is that you have to be very careful what you say and who you say it to. Otherwise, some vicious fuck such as myself will overhear and use it against you. Now you go and be a good girl, vote for whomsoever you want to…
May 21, 2009 at 2:25 am
Catriona Rafael, salvation is possible. You have only voted twice. Once in the State election and once in a Federal election. Both times you got it wrong. You lost. Voted for the wrong gang. Was a loser. Got done. Well beaten. In the minority. Vote Labor ! Be a winner! Follow Ayn Rand, think only of yourself, dont back losers just ’cause your silly friends do. Vote Labor– third time lucky.
May 21, 2009 at 2:25 am
“consented to their image being used”
And I’m sure Liberal Party Executive will hear that and rest easy, knowing this tarnishes their party’s image in no way – as the girls consent is the only issue here isn’t it…
…isn’t it?
(clue: it isn’t)
May 21, 2009 at 2:27 am
David, mate, Catriona needs no encouragement.
May 21, 2009 at 2:30 am
Haha, you keep telling yourself that, “Henry” dear. Too much of a coward to post under your real name, even!
May 21, 2009 at 2:37 am
And?
May 21, 2009 at 2:38 am
And you’re not so much a “vicious fuck” as a coward and a loser. Keep those insults coming, they’re entertaining 😀
May 21, 2009 at 2:44 am
It has been said above, but ahahahahah “social experiment”? You embarrassed yourself, the party and the movement with a bad judgement call. Don’t try and out-clever yourself and pretend that your fuck-up was a layercake of irony. Just fess up, and move on. I doubt anyone will care beyond next week.
May 21, 2009 at 2:49 am
Julian,
This is one of the fundamental problems with capitalist libertarianism: it acknowledges no absolute transcendent values, anything consented to is “OK”.
There is no concept of something being intrinsically wrong. So a girl gets jizzed by a group brainless moron rugby players after consenting to it, and then, after the fact, feels so degraded she attempts suicide. Libertarians just don’t understand that there are objective values that are above mere whim, consent or democratic vote.
These values cannot be reduced to financial units or be traded or compromised in any way (this is why the existence of the institution of slavery was such an abomination in Western Civ).
Capitalist libertarians believe in liberal autonomy theory, where “individuals” are entirely self defined and any inherent group characteristics are written off as “social constructs” (example: gender or ethnicity) to be discouraged (progressive education) or made illegal (discrimination laws).
The only thing these people worship is the “individual” (apparently residing in a vacuum) and the “market” which means they would find no principled basis to critique a dysfunctional and demographically declining shariah state in their own back yard, so long as it had the most reformed tax system on the planet.
Their entire world view can be summed up thus: free market rim jobs. In other words, these people are intellectual juveniles, not to be treated too seriously.
In other words: Libertarians = Leftists too embarrassed to admit it.
May 21, 2009 at 2:52 am
Is that a yes Catriona. Does Labor get your next vote? Will you stand a winner on your next election night? Say it is so. A pretty thing with such nice pearls should not be a loser.
May 21, 2009 at 2:55 am
Sorry David, but I don’t countenance socialists :p
May 21, 2009 at 3:03 am
Both terms are frames. The discussion is pointless, and to be honest around here you will get nothing but rhetoric from a bunch of intellectually lazy half-wits who assemble arguments by copy-pasting from the Milton Freidman wikipedia page.
You can draw up a ‘libertarian’ bod and a ‘leftist’ around certain criteria, and then bicker on here as to where exactly the borders are for both (libertarianism/classic liberalism has been browsing down the aisle of self-reference for far too long as it is) – what’s the point? It never goes ANYWHERE. You can always increase the cardinality/criteria, and the borders will fall away until you have another epic argument. It’s a bit like when the left/right political line was broken into four compass points. If you want to practice social science, you can play that game – but for the purposes of argument, it’s redundant.
And you’re wrong on natural rights.
May 21, 2009 at 3:18 am
Interesting that noone has commented that Andrews and Goward are both from the Team.
Friction amongst the ranks?
May 21, 2009 at 3:30 am
As an inaugural Teamster, neither Goward nor Andrews were from the Team. Not the real one anyway.
Good to see that one of the poster boys for political failure has reared his pompous head.
May 21, 2009 at 3:36 am
hey, i think the only broad that you missed out was eva braun. man, whadda pair ‘a legs.
May 21, 2009 at 3:58 am
Hey, I’m all for the objectification of men, too. Hurry up Tim!
May 21, 2009 at 4:19 am
…well I for one am extremely pissed off about how much publicity this has gotten. My blog simply cannot compete.
May 21, 2009 at 6:26 am
Tim, there are two options for comment moderation:
1. Manually approving each post before it’s published.
2. Continue with the current system, but have a “report” link through which readers can report errant posts.
Both methods are somewhat ad-hoc, but there really isn’t an automatic way of preventing defamatory or other illegal posts.
May 21, 2009 at 8:07 am
To Greg (http://web.vee.net/stuff/liberalpartyasshat/#comment-695)
Take a chill pill, Ralph was crass, perhaps a little rude, “morally decrepit” is just ridiculous.
I mean, come on, obviously there is some tongue in cheek in this post, and with that we have this idea about really attractive women, yet those posted are barely above normal / average looks. It really pulls the story from up in the stands, down into the bleachers.
And Henry, sure he’s a painful conservative and certainly oblivious to most forward thinking ideas, again, no need for you to sit on your horse there and cast stones. It doesn’t help your cause, at all, people will just disregard you.
I agree with your sentiment, you just fucked the execution.
May 21, 2009 at 3:46 pm
G’day Tim.
Some thoughts from an old blogger : Let anyone post but don’t publish until after reviewed by yourself. Then after the post has had a fair run, close of comments.
ta
Ralph
PS I’m NOT that Ralph!
May 21, 2009 at 6:57 pm
Hey, Tim – I thought you were residing in the “land of the free”??? this isn’t a forum that is going to dictate government policy, is it??? then don’t worry about moderating it too much. I’m unaware of the legal responsibilities of a blog site – are there any ??? If not, let people be hoist on their own petard.I am sick and tired of Political correctness, let people jam both feet in their mouths if they want to – or if they don’t have the eloquence and vocabulary to clearly enunciate their point. It’s so much fun AND, you actually get to find out what people think.
May 21, 2009 at 7:17 pm
You’re all ignoring the real issue here – sadly the Google cache reveals much less hotness than ABC News led us to believe would be the case…
May 21, 2009 at 7:30 pm
“I am sick and tired of Political correctness…”
You “Young” Lib’s need to think bigger. You personally might not have a problem with the post – but the Party in general certainly does *because it reflects badly on the party*… don’t you get it yet?
When you post ostensibly recruiting for the LP, and you have strong ties to the LP then what you *do* effects the LP. Regardless of whether you think “it’s all just a bit of laugh” or not.
May 21, 2009 at 7:48 pm
Tim! … Michelle here from ABC Radio in Darwin. I do an afternoon program and we’d love to have a quick yarn with you about your incredibly splash-causing post!
Can you pls send me your number if poss?
crowther.michelle[at] abc.net.au
May 21, 2009 at 8:08 pm
How can you say that Australian Politics lacks humour? Take another look at the Australian National Liberal Party Leader. Problem is most people can not even remember his name but all know he is a joke
May 21, 2009 at 8:14 pm
Aussie Comedian: Are you talking about the Federal Parlaimentary Liberal Party Leader or are you talking about the Liberal National Party?
If it is the former then you should not capitalise national.
May 21, 2009 at 8:22 pm
“If it is the former then you should not capitalise national.”
Thats f’n comedy gold right there!
…I mean surely you’re parodying the stereotype of the sniffly young Liberal… right?
May 21, 2009 at 8:28 pm
Dry your eyes princess. Some rabid, pinko, back to the trees, enviro-femo nazis don’t like your post so you take it down?!?!?
Man up for godsake. You have folded faster than superman on laundry day. “Oh noes! Thomeone dothen’t like what I pothted…oh noeth whateves thall I do?”
You capitulated sonny-jim, What would Howard do? Hmmm? Hmmm? Did he carry on like a little girl with a skinned knee when people disagreed with him? No He took it on the jaw and said “Please sir may I have another”.
May 21, 2009 at 8:37 pm
Look – I used to be in the left so I can sympathyse with Tim. I know that when you change your stripes it forever haunts you, some pr**k is always trying to undermine you and remind you about your soft left past – but I dont think that has anything to do with this current blow-up.
Good on you tim!
And although captain wacky is a little off the mark – I’ would suggest putting the post back up, if only to show that you’re either a) standing by your views or b) a big enough man to admit it was an error.
People can see the whole damn thing on google cache now anyway so may as well not let it fester… unless those hidden comments have already got out of hand too.
May 21, 2009 at 8:38 pm
So a “libertarian” is going to curtail free speech by “comment moderation”. There is a more apt word for that, gentle readers, censorship. That’s right my friends this leading libertarian, or dare I say, Dear Leader, has seized the Rudd/Conroy agenda of limiting free speech on the internet.
How did the leading light of liberals fall under the spell of socialism?
The ball is in your caught Comrade Tim.
May 21, 2009 at 8:45 pm
But but, this is ok http://australasianliberal.blogspot.com/2009/03/kevin-rudds-shitstorm.html But….
May 21, 2009 at 8:46 pm
Tim,
I’m producer of the Afetrnoon show on 720 Radio Perth, having trouble contacting you via other means, but we’d love to have an on air discussion about the issues your post has raised.
We’ll be starting the talkback at about 3:00pm Perth time.
Please contact us via the supplied email address if you’re interested in puting your version of the story foward and being involved in the discussion.
Elaine
May 21, 2009 at 8:49 pm
“But but, this is ok”
Its easier to fix a f**k up when you’re at the top. It gets diluted by all the other news floating about…
Much harder to fix when your an aspirational-nobody. This is *all* that will be remembered…
May 21, 2009 at 8:49 pm
Damn bitzhchtnzatch, yo muthah D’s full! You gotta bust a move ta mothah fuckin’ CompUSA to get a new G-money Maxtor, yo! we finishin up a couple raps for da album. Wez workin’ on da songs “Cop Done Falls” and “Bustin Shit Up”.
here’s all we gots from “Cop Done Falls”:
Mothafuckin’ man, you got trapped in mah way
Now comes mah Glok, my Smith and Westin gone’ stay
Mothah Bitch comes rollin, fools done trip out
Got a key of stump gonna roll out
Foos gone play out cuz trades gone werd
Trip dat bitch to a final fizz, money’s all spent
Flip out strip to da light gone switch foo’ drip
Playaz gone ill when da thrill shots blanks
(chorus)
He’s tip o da lip, flying like Niro
He ain’t got trousers, stuck in place like Hiro
It’s dawg eat dawg and yo salad’s been tossed
Cop done fall like Who’s Da Boss
Dats all so far
May 21, 2009 at 9:07 pm
Tim on twitter “With the benefit of hindsight, will concede I should have included the Liberal Men post at the same time the Liberal Girl one was posted”
Don’t think so champ. I think that would drive women from the Libs’s screaming. They would be all like “Aargh!” and “Waaaaah! The Liberals are bipedal elephant seals” and jun.
May 21, 2009 at 9:26 pm
Alex Howen Says:
May 20, 2009 at 9:00 pm
In my view Tim, you should always retain control of your blog and that includes comment moderation. It is however up to you how much “free speech” you will allow. You should not allow your constructive blog to be a place to broadcast hate etc. Stupidity and ignorance however should be displayed for all to see so do not edit those posts out of your blog.
What ya talkin bout dawg? you jes like da othah rappahz, you fraid of us. We gon roll all ovah yah and plant corn in yo eyes, wez pimpin shit on da fly yea
PLAYAH HATAH!!! PLAYAH HATAH!!!!!!!
May 22, 2009 at 2:44 am
Tim — I suggest having a comments policy that outlines the sort of discussion you want. If people violate that policy, then you can either edit/delete their posts, or if they are a particular pain, put them on moderation.
If you let people derail conversation as done above then you crowd-out sensible/friendly discussion.
You will probably have to explain how having rules on your own property is perfectly consistent with libertarian philosophy and is qualitatively different from government restrictions on free speech. While the point is obvious, you would be amazed how many people get confused on this issue (as shown above).
May 23, 2009 at 8:54 am
Wicked!
May 23, 2009 at 9:17 am
[…] part 2 entry. For the original text of the post head on over to Tim’s blog, some of the comments from uptight people are amusing […]